Tires

[CjrJAM]

Since we don't have a thread to discuss one of our most important resources I thought I'd start one. I know, I know this has been discussed many times on the old site and in many other forums, but I need some new rubba for track day. What do you all suggest? I spoke to Evan and Jeremy at Lee's last time I was there and I commented on the Pirelli and they insisted it was just hype surrounding those tires. They said they were unpredictable and that they recommend Dunlop. It kinda made me wonder whether if that is the case because of a possible endorsement. :rolleyes: They went on and mentioned that the pirellis are not as rigid and allow for sloppy riding ie. sliding. WTF? I have heard nothing but good about them....HELP. :errf:

[kc1717]

the 208 gp and the sc1 sc2 tires are both great tires


differences that i see are in the front tires
208 has quick turning but twitchy on the strights and prone to slappers, the rensports and supercorsa fronts are less radical and have more stright line stability but more effort to turn.

i prefer the supercorsas because im not 'needing' a faster turn in yet, but i appriciate the stright line stability

[speedster1219]

I've only run rennesports rs1, rs2-- I love these tires..stick like crazy, rounder profile...pricey but worth it...

[Bryant]

Originally posted by kc1717
the 208 gp and the sc1 sc2 tires are both great tires


differences that i see are in the front tires
208 has quick turning but twitchy on the strights and prone to slappers, the rensports and supercorsa fronts are less radical and have more stright line stability but more effort to turn.

i prefer the supercorsas because im not 'needing' a faster turn in yet, but i appriciate the stright line stability

I honestly did not feel that it took more effort to turn my bike using the Pirelli Supercorsa's vs. Dunlop D208GP's. This is both slow and fast speeds. In fact, I did feel that it was actually easier to turn my bike on the Pirelli tires than I did on the Dunlop D208GP's that I rode on only one day prior to trying the Supercorsa tires. The whole "Dunlop fronts" being "twitchy" on the straights was really something experienced with the D207GP tires. The D208GP's have a much more rounded crowning than the D207GP's did...

I did crash on Pirellis though.. so that did sorta leave a bad taste in my mouth about them since that was the first and only time I raced on those tires. But I can't really blame the tires as I did find that the tires were waaaay over inflated (didn't bother to check the pressures after I thought the dudes at Pirelli booth set them for me before I rushed out to pre-grid for the race!!!). Having never tested on these tires before, I was immediately comfortable with them (despite the over-inflation) and was holding my own in 3rd position most of the time during the 20 lap Solo GTU race. In fact, I was so comfortable with them that I was actually doing my best laptimes ever on these very tires lapping in the 1:27 range at WSIR. These tires also allowed me to find the limits of my bike's *stock* suspension that i was running at the time. I was dragging the crap out of my rearsets in nearly every turn except for 6, 7 and 8. I'm sure all of these things contributed to my eventual demise towards the end of the GTU race... but yeah, I dunno. I can honestly say that I had the best times both riding and on the stopwatch with these tires.

This is a photo of me running on the Pirelli tires for the first time (no practice and only one warmup lap to get used to these tires that still had pieces of the tire specification stickers stuck on them!)
http://www.jusspress.com/132/20021110/101834.jpghttp://www.jusspress.com/132/20021110/101833.jpg
Here's an example of something that plagued me while I was racing on the Dunlops at WSIR... I would have the hardest time getting on the gas as early as I wanted to going over turn 6 mid-corner on the Dunlops as my front tire would always skip off the ground through there. With the Pirellis, I felt NONE of that... the Pirelli's felt much more pliable and capable of absorbing more of the road imperfections than the Dunlops thus transferring less stress to the suspension. I was, for the first time in a long time, able to keep the throttle basically pinned through turn 6 with little to no drama! I also felt like the Pirelli tires were much lighter weight... so when I was travelling at speed, perhaps that was why it felt easier to turn with these tires as opposed to the Dunlops. I actually did verify that the Pirelli's were lighter due to their zero-degree belt construction.

Jeremy Toye from Lee's is a freakin fast guy out at WIllow SPrings... so perhaps people riding at his level (which is pretty much god-like) would have trouble with tires like the Pirelli. BUT, for sloooower people like me... the Pirellis felt like what I might call "magic tires". :cool: Oh.. and contrary to what I've been hearing some other people say... I found that slides with the Pirellis were very predictable and easy to control.... except for that freakin last one in turn 2 at 120mph where I actually had a few moments to wonder why i was no longer turning right but drifting tangentially towards the edge of the track! BUT.. that's a story for another time.

Also you might want to note that Jeremy is very accustomed to Dunlops..he's been racing on them for the longest time. There are other professional racers who have actually broken several lap records on those Metzeler Rennsports (same as Pirelli basically) and even on Pirelli tires as well if I remember correctly so it REALLY depends on the rider. That is almost always the bottom line with most things.

Some like Dunlops better some like Pirelli better.. some swear by Michelin and others are cult fans of Bridgestone... u really have to try them all and find out what works best for *YOU*.

Heck.. the world superbike camp are all running Pirellis and those guys are all a bit more than god-like in speed... I haven't heard of any complaints as of yet... but realistically, everyone's got a gripe about one thing or another on every tire out there on the market.

[Bryant]

Originally posted by CjrJAM
They went on and mentioned that the pirellis are not as rigid and allow for sloppy riding ie. sliding. WTF? I have heard nothing but good about them....HELP. :errf:

With regard to the "sloppy riding" bit.. it doesn't allow for sloppy riding but it may cater more to riders who perhaps don't mind a little wheelspin while they are riding. I did notice (although my review of these tires should be taken with a few grains of salt since I ran these tires about 10psi too high in each tire!!) that they do tend to slide a tad bit more than the Dunlops did after say 9 laps on Willow Springs International Raceway's 2.5 mile roadcourse.

[GPTECHMAN]

Im calling BS ceez. LEE's only sells dunlops...well mainly.. DOn't go by what they say...they're frickin salesmen, I don't care if they can ride....they have dunlops in stock and thats what they want to sell you. I have run the supercorsas and michelin, but haven't had a chance on the dunlops and metz'z. The only difference I can tell you is the profile. The supercorsas have a rounder profile and allow for a more stable ride in the straights and in my opinion allow for a delayed apex turning style. you can be more upright and hang out until you see the exit and then huck it in, allowing for more contact patch on exit and in the entry?(I dont know if that makes sense) and the dunlops or michelins are much more triangular and allow for them to be hucked in the turn and to hold crazy amounts of corner speed.(more contact patch when banked over on its side. They have more of a falling effect. I personally have complete confidence in pirellis and michelins and would love to try some GPs in the future. Right now I think that Im more of a wait until I see the exit kinda guy rather than throwing it in and going balls out.....thats just me and my 87 cents

[TreAdidas]

I have ran Dunlop 208 ZR's which are basically total crap... and the Pirelli Diablos... (I currently have two sets) and I am rather fond of especially with their "superior wet traction" :) ..... I want to try Michelin's though... sean's seemed to work really well for him... so For what that's worth...

[GPTECHMAN]

Originally posted by TreAdidas
"superior wet traction" :)


:clap:

hey Ceez, are you gonna be running them after track day. I might suggest just the Diablos? Chuck ran them and they worked killer for him and if that pirelli deal is goin on then it might save you a few bucks. Also the fron they give you is a 70 series so we'll have to drop the triple a bit

but if you get just the rear you'd be all over that

[deathblow]

Great information there Bryant, thanks!

I have used Dunlops, Michelins and Metzelers. By far, my favorite tire has been the Metzeler Rennsport, RS1 front ans RS2 rear. Also let me state that I have never used the Dunlop 208GPs, but from what Bryant, Arnold, and Marc say, they are awesome tires.

I also have had some gnarly slides from the Rennsports, but that was from a way overused tire at Palomar, which Bryant witnessed. I had a couple huge slides at SOW with new ones, but they were also 10PSI over-inflated, once they had the right pressure and heat in them, it was on! If you can find the good prices on the Rennsports, Supercorsas, 208GPs, Pilot Race 2s, go for them, those tires are on the top of the totem pole right now and I think it would be difficult for us to go above their limits, with maybe the exception of Bryant :).

Just for comparison's sake, my next tires will be the 208GPs, I am pretty curious to their performance.

[Arnold_R1]

Coming from RS1's/RS2's and switching to Dunlops, I can really say that I had a better experience with 208GP's as opposed to RS1's. The GP's offer much more feel especially when they are cold. You feel every little bump when they are cold, but once they warm up, gummy. The Rennsports do grip none the less, but it's that positive feedback I got from the GP's that made me a Dunlop fanatic.

[CjrJAM]

Whatever I get I will leave on until I wear out. After the track day I still have Palomar and commuting to look forward too so please keep that in perspective. So what to do what to do?:rolleyes:

[GPTECHMAN]

I say diablos...30% track 70 % street!

and "superior wet traction"

[CjrJAM]

Diablo Corsa right?

[TreAdidas]

Originally posted by CjrJAM
Diablo Corsa right?

Nah baby nah... I just rolled straight up Diablos at the track and since like early October up on Palomar... I could see rolling a Diablo Corsa, but I had no worries with the straight up Diablos. I just do not think I am to that level wehre I would realize a difference yet... I mean even on their website you are looking at like a 20% increase but hell if you got the bling hook it up! The straight Diablos are better in the rain which unfortuantely is a reality I have to contend with moreso than you kids :rolleyes:

Originally posted by GPTechman
I say diablos...30% track 70 % street!

and "superior wet traction"


I did that just for you :clap: :D

[kc1717]

Originally posted by TreAdidas
Nah baby nah... I just rolled straight up Diablos at the track and since like early October up on Palomar... I could see rolling a Diablo Corsa, but I had no worries with the straight up Diablos. I just do not think I am to that level wehre I would realize a difference yet... I mean even on their website you are looking at like a 20% increase but hell if you got the bling hook it up! The straight Diablos are better in the rain which unfortuantely is a reality I have to contend with moreso than you kids :rolleyes:




I did that just for you :clap: :D


just put the D corsa up front